MY Roe GTS with Pics

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Not only did I get the computer to befriend my ECU in my GTS finally, but I washed it as well as the Stealth TT. 

And a few more

Paolo, there is confusion.

My Roe sc'd GTS went 175mph at Cold Lake Alta.  195mph in just under 2 miles.  At Ely it was 180mph in the mile at 6500' last fall.  Street tires etc.  My TT GTS went 215mph at Mojave Mile in about 3/4 of a mile on 28" tires.  http://vipernationinternational.com/2012/06/06/mojave-mile-asp-kickin/

Twin's Motorsports TT GTS also went 215mph at 10 psi boost.  He upped the boost, went 218.3 mph equaling 1250whp Big Red's speed.  His next pass he upped the boost some more and smashed 5th gear out of his GForce trans (same trans as mine).  A Hefner 1080whp (race tuned) went 113mph before his turbo blew up.  A 1100bhp Veyron SS managed 201mph there that day (Hot Rod magazine).

My TT GTS feels the same as my Roe car unless there is boost, then the TT goes insane.  R6 slicks have no traction in 3rd gear with boost. 

Paolo, there is confusion.

My Roe sc'd GTS went 175mph at Colc Lake Alta.  195mph in just under 2 miles.  At Ely it was 180mph in the mile at 6500' last fall.  Street tires etc.  My TT GTS went 215mph at Mojave Mile in about 3/4 of a mile on 28" tires.  http://vipernationinternational.com/2012/06/06/mojave-mile-asp-kickin/

Twin's Motorsports TT GTS also went 215mph at 10 psi boost.  He upped the boost, went 218.3 mph equaling 1250whp Big Red's speed.  His next pass he upped the boost some more and smashed 5th gear out of his GForce trans (same trans as mine).  A Hefner 1080whp (race tuned) went 113mph before his turbo blew up.  A 1100bhp Veyron SS managed 201mph there that day (Hot Rod magazine).

My TT GTS feels the same as my Roe car unless there is boost, then the TT goes insane.  R6 slicks have no traction in 3rd gear with boost.

Ted,  from this post,

At 6,500' my Roe GTS went 152mph in the standing Halfmile.  No tire warming, parked, drive 2 blocks slowly, idle to the start line and away you go!  176mph with shit street tires with the TT at 10psi (1100hp) - got traction in 4th I think.  176mph is in 6th.

I thought you said your TT went 176(180) MPH with 1100 RWHP at higher elevation.

In regards to some pf the power levels you posted to go a certain MPH in the mile, you can't believe everything all the people say all the time.........

A customer car (bone stock 1997 GTS T-4 1.32 AR hot sides with cast 66 mm compressor wheels on 13 PSI on pump gas making about 850 RWHP) of mine went 213MPH and hit the rev limiter 1000' before the finish line which is 280' past where you hit 215 at the 3/4 mile mark. You were making at the most another 50 or 75 RWHP to go 215 MPH 280' sooner than the stocker hitting 213 with 850 RWHP.

I dont think it takes 1250 RWHP to go 218 MPH in the mile. I am sure the Aero on Big Red is not the best but I doubt even that car needs 1250 RWHP to go 218 in the mile. I feel my stocker customer car with a few more RPM or slightly different gearing could have hit 218 MPH in another 1000' from 213.

anything is possible Paolo.

Big Red Camaro has many speed records.  He has his own website www.bigredcamaro.com and set several records at SSCC as well as running at Texas etc.

Mojave Mile and Ely are probably the slowest miles.  No burnouts, no warm up except driving and 3600' altitude at the Spaceport (where they landed the Shuttles on the west coast.  Many miles use a rolling start and burnout to heat the tires.  Slow cars can use Drag Radials but those are not rated to over 200mph, although I was reading that at least one track back east allows them to be run.  Guy was adviced on their forum to run wrinkle slicks.  Obviously not manufacturer specifications.  Faster, but dangerous. 

Near as I can tell Texas mile is by far the fastest Mile on the continent.  They can doi burnouts and are at sea level.  267mph in a standing mile is unbelieveable.  But he may have had a tire company make the tires just for him ... he has more money than God I believe the expression goes.  Fastest time at Mojave is 232mph and that was 1500whp AWD.  With his traction he also set the Halfmile record at 200mph.

If it was NHRA they would allow a 10% 'factor' for the loss of power to altitiude LOL.  The altitude doesn't matter in his huge boost car. 

Henry ran 750whp Paxton at Mojave Mile and couldn't go faster than 195mph until he upgraded the trans OD gears.  3.55 weren't enough.  I think that my 720whp Roe Viper would easily go 200+ in the mile at 6,500' with just changing out the 5 & 6 gears.  Course that's a torque monster 

I understand that at 220mph the grille opening and brake ducts go stagnant and then vacuum.  It's gonna be interesting. 

Each record set at each track is only the record for that track, not all tracks, otherwise the only track that counts is Texas?

anything is possible Paolo.

Big Red Camaro has many speed records.  He has his own website www.bigredcamaro.com and set several records at SSCC as well as running at Texas etc.

Mojave Mile and Ely are probably the slowest miles.  No burnouts, no warm up except driving and 3600' altitude at the Spaceport (where they landed the Shuttles on the west coast.  Many miles use a rolling start and burnout to heat the tires.  Slow cars can use Drag Radials but those are not rated to over 200mph, although I was reading that at least one track back east allows them to be run.  Guy was adviced on their forum to run wrinkle slicks.  Obviously not manufacturer specifications.  Faster, but dangerous. 

Near as I can tell Texas mile is by far the fastest Mile on the continent.  They can doi burnouts and are at sea level.  267mph in a standing mile is unbelieveable.  But he may have had a tire company make the tires just for him ... he has more money than God I believe the expression goes.  Fastest time at Mojave is 232mph and that was 1500whp AWD.  With his traction he also set the Halfmile record at 200mph.

If it was NHRA they would allow a 10% 'factor' for the loss of power to altitiude LOL.  The altitude doesn't matter in his huge boost car. 

Henry ran 750whp Paxton at Mojave Mile and couldn't go faster than 195mph until he upgraded the trans OD gears.  3.55 weren't enough.  I think that my 720whp Roe Viper would easily go 200+ in the mile at 6,500' with just changing out the 5 & 6 gears.  Course that's a torque monster 

I understand that at 220mph the grille opening and brake ducts go stagnant and then vacuum.  It's gonna be interesting. 

Each record set at each track is only the record for that track, not all tracks, otherwise the only track that counts is Texas?

Ted, I agree with a lot of what you said except that the 1500 AWHP seen on the dyno is simply not being made in ANY mile race much less one at higher altitude. 1500 AWHP is on some B.S. dynojet for a 2 second pull. Think about making low, medium and big power under street load for the duration of a full mile for about 24 seconds...... Think of the finite amount of water in a liquid to air water tank or heat sink capacity of a given air-air IC core....... for every +100 degrees of AIT's, that is 20% lesser density of air molecules ie 20% less power. On 1500AWHP, that is 300AWHP. I bet the ait's at the end of the mile are probably a minimum of 200 degrees higher than on the dyno. With air-air and no air going through the front end, it would be an astronomically higher percentage and lower air density and power level. Now multiply this for Bonneville's 7 mile course......

The other thing to consider at high altitude is that the turbos will just spin faster to make up for the lower air density, this will lead to higher back pressure and lower efficiency as well. Depending upon the hot and cold side turbo sizing, larger turbos will not be affected nearly as much. That's why big turbos and higher revving motors are more favorable for such a venue.

The Lambos use a hig revving 5.2L engine so (from what the owner said) what they lack in torque they make up for in hp.  That's why they run high boost. 

The Lambos have become spectacular last few years though.  Mark Capeners is extremely fast and it ran 202mph in a halfmile shootout.  Only 30mph faster through the second halfmile to 232mph in the mile.  That beat both the 2200whp Griffin TT GTS and the Ford GT record at the Mojave Mile.

I could speculate and agree with your hp drop as it goes down the road, but I don't know.  Perhaps, like my TT GTS, he only has gears to go 232mph? 

I agree that dyno numbers are just that.  If you don't like them go to a different dyno.  A dyno is just a tuning tool, not a road or a track.

I had planned to go to Kelowna to a Viper Owners Association weekend and that included a Car Show (perhaps an outdoor parking lot display for members?).  I built a bracket and installed the contoured rear hard panels from my TT GTS for looks.  I've uploaded a picture of the trunk floor carpet cover, then the carpet hatch cover and finally two of the hard panels.

Kirk had these formed out of MSBoard and Leather covered.  The Sneaky Pete logo has Neon lights that cause the logo to light in glowing Blue (which I didn't connect). 

The VOA weekend didn't work out as I started trying to find a Hotel room a couple hours before leaving and ... only $200+ rooms available.  It was raining hard and the forecast for Kelowna was for heavy rain all weekend.  Wife was a little late meaning that we'd have to drive to 3am arrival time.  I got frustrated and gave up.  I'll do the next weekend Car Show in Williams Lake (only 3 hr drive from here). 

The Lambos use a hig revving 5.2L engine so (from what the owner said) what they lack in torque they make up for in hp.  That's why they run high boost. 

The Lambos have become spectacular last few years though.  Mark Capeners is extremely fast and it ran 202mph in a halfmile shootout.  Only 30mph faster through the second halfmile to 232mph in the mile.  That beat both the 2200whp Griffin TT GTS and the Ford GT record at the Mojave Mile.

I could speculate and agree with your hp drop as it goes down the road, but I don't know.  Perhaps, like my TT GTS, he only has gears to go 232mph? 

I agree that dyno numbers are just that.  If you don't like them go to a different dyno.  A dyno is just a tuning tool, not a road or a track.

Ted, the lambos have enough RPM and gearing to go 250+ as they have gone in the Texas Mile....

1000 AWTQ @ 8500 RPM is 1620 AWHP..........

There is no way the Bob Griffith Twins Turbo TT GTS is making 2200 RWHP and not going close to 275 MPH in the mile. That car has only T-4 80mm turbos good for 1250 HP each. I would bet that car was not turned up all that much at all if it only went 218 MPH. I would say 218 MPH would be a sea level corrected 850-900 RWHP max. Griffith also has an air-air IC which will get heat soaked by the 1/2 mile. According to Shane T, who tuned the ART Ballista TT, it had high AIT's by the second 1/2 mile which limited the power and therefore the speed by quite a bit.

As I said, he ran equal to the 1250hp Big Red Camaro and then busted his GForce T56 (same one I have).  Griffin's car was tuned by Shane as well.  He was tuning it up each run until it busted. 

Interesting that Griffin lives in California but his MM record was 225mph and that was beat by a FGT to 227 and then the Lambo went 232. 

I am not making up numbers, just reporting what I saw and what was posted. 

The one thing I agree most with is comparing event for event.

My local 1/4 track makes all cars look slow on paper yet comparing the cars at the track , you can really see the difference between slow and slower.....

Same thing with dyno. Dyno for dyno like me and Ted did. Not argument can be made that way.

The one thing I agree most with is comparing event for event.

My local 1/4 track makes all cars look slow on paper yet comparing the cars at the track , you can really see the difference between slow and slower.....

Same thing with dyno. Dyno for dyno like me and Ted did. Not argument can be made that way.

Joel, I agree. I was just saying that there is no way it takes 2200 RWHP to go 218 MPH in the mile at the Mojave mile. If there is a correction for a lesser air density at higher altitude, then the cars are making correspondingly less than their sea level dyno numbers that people speak of when they are saying they are running X boost(sea level RWHP) to go X MPH. Not to mention the heat soak associated with the longer time in boost to do the 1 mile race with an air-air IC like Bob Griffith has.

Griffin's car wasn't full out at that run.  At 10psi he made exactly the same 215.0mph that I did at 10psi.  His car has been posted as 1500, 1800 and also 2200hp.  What boost and tune settings he uses will affect hp.  No one said what hp his car made going 218.3mph.  Maybe only 1250 as Hot Rod Magazine stated that Big Red's Camaro used to go 218.3mph?  I know he was testing Nitrous Oxide that weekend on his 1100hp BBC. 

Are cars in the Eastern Timing Assoc really allowed to run VR and other slower rated radials at over 200mph?  Here the Mojave Mile requires nothing less than ZR WITH (Y)   or your higher than 205 mph will not be recorded and your runs disqualified (as mine were).   

I bought a set of used Gen 2 valves and valve train.  I backcut the valves and gave them a quick surface grind (I own a valve grinder) and while doing that I compared the intakes to the ported Gen 3 head intake valve sitting on my bench and noticed they were quite differently sized.  When I wrote the "school me on heads thread I measured the intake valves of my Viper heads (this Viper) as 1.96" or so only a few hundreds smaller than the 2.00" of the Gen 3 heads. 

Interesting that my Sapphire GTS had stock ports, but oversized intake valves installed.  Weirdness.

Cleaned my Roe GTS and built a new streamline panel behind the nose to direct the airflow past the radiator far enough to create a suction pulling air through the radiator for aerodynamics and better cooling.  After installing my TT GTSs rear cover panels and window under the hatch I drove the GTS to Williams Lake for the Laker's Spring Round Up Car Show.  Up at 5am and headed down hwy 20 before 5:30 am. 

Joel Fortin and his Dad Elie drove Joel's TT GTS from Vanderhoof to meet me there.  I saved him a spot beside me and we "showed" a few hours before heading off to the pub for dinner and home.   People's Choice award was given to a mint 1970 Hemi Orange Superbird.  Considering that there was many rain showers I was amazed at the amount of people that walked through.  Our cars were surrounded by people and they were quite popular. 

I found it interesting that there were very few technical questions for us.  It seems that people mostly know nothing about cars and few know much about performance systems.  I had my display signs out and that works quiet well to explain to people that with Nitrous Oxide turned on, even my 800bhp Viper can be boosted past 1000hp easily.  Although there was a couple RX7s with 500+whp ... I spent half the day explaining that even if their AWD could outperform my 14" wide rear tires ... their cars don't got past 130mph while our Vipers are just starting to go once they get shifted into 3rd gear at 95mph!